The OpenAI board member who fired Sam Altman says we still can’t trust AI CEOs

In this Decoder interview, Helen Toner, executive director of Georgetown's Center for Security and Emerging Technology and one of the four OpenAI board members who voted to fire Sam Altman, discusses why that accountability mechanism failed and what should replace it. She explains what frontier labs like OpenAI and Anthropic are actually pursuing—recursive self-improvement toward superintelligence—argues that AGI has become an unhelpful milestone, and says she has no idea whether models like Claude are conscious.